<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>I assume that Phil means that there should be a way of getting rid of the Listener. In the MCL based version of AgentSheets we have a end user / developer switch (only available through a key file). In end user mode you get:</div><div><br></div><div>- only application menus (no List tools etc)</div><div>- no listener</div><div>- all error and warning wrapped up in standard alerts with some some syntactic clean up</div><div>- disabled debugging tools, i.e., not backtrace etc.</div><div><br></div><div>If you want to deploy an app this is pretty important. End users really do not want to see or interact with listeners. </div><div><br></div><div>Alex</div><div><br></div><br><div><div>On Dec 23, 2008, at 2:54 PM, Gary Byers wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div>I'm afraid that I don't really have much of a model of how your <br>application is structured, of what behavior you're seeing and of<br>what behavior you want to see, or of what any of this has to do<br>with CCL.<br><br>Besides noting that Windows, X environments under Linux, and OSX<br>all have different views of:<br><br>- whether there's a distinction between "console applications"<br>and "GUI applications" (and, if so, how that distinction is<br>maintained)<br>- (related) what it means for an application to be associated<br>with a console or terminal window<br>- what happens (in general and in specific cases) when someone<br>opens an icon in a desktop environment,<br><br>it's not clear what to say that could be useful.<br><br>On OSX, must things that you'd think of as GUI applications are<br>packaged as application bundles (special directories whose extension<br>is ".app" and whose contents follow certain conventions.) If you<br>double-click on "foo.app"'s icon in the Finder, the application<br>starts up, with its own icon in the Dock and its own menubar; the<br>new process's standard input comes from the null device and output<br>goes to some logging device. If you execute "open foo.app" in a<br>shell or shell script, essentially the same things (includung<br>the I/O redirection) happen as when the file is opened in the Finder.<br>(The "open" in that case is just "/usr/bin/open", which basically<br>just uses the same system services that the Finder uses to open<br>files and URLs that it receives as command-line arguments.)<br><br>The actual executable involved in running "foo.app" is nside the <br>Contents/MacOS subdirectory of the .app bundle. (The exectuable<br>file is often the only file in that directory and its name often<br>matches the bundle directory's name without the ".app"; its name<br>is specified as the value of some XML key in Contents/Info.plist.)<br>If you run the executable directly (in the shell or a shell script):<br><br>shell> /path/to/foo.app/Contents/MacOS/foo<br><br>then most things will likely be the same as they would be if the<br>app was launched via "open" or the Finder; one notable difference<br>is that the I/O redirection won't have happened and the process<br>will remain connected to the same standard I/O streams as the<br>parent (shell) uses (unless of course it's invoked with some<br>sort of explicit redirection.)<br><br>If you double-click on a non-.app executable file in the Finder,<br>the Finder will generally open a Terminal.app window and run<br>the executable "in that window" (e.g., with its standard input<br>coming from and standard output going to that Terminal window.)<br>It seems to do this via a technique not obviously different from<br>writing a .cmd file somewhere and then opening that file.<br><br>If you select an application bundle in the Finder and right-click<br>(or ctrl-click) on it, you'll get a menu with an option named<br>"Show Package Contents" (or something similar.) If you select<br>that option and navigate to the executable inside Contents/MacOS,<br>you'll get similar behavior.<br><br>Again, I can't tell from your message what application is not<br>(accidentally or intentionally) display a console/terminal<br>window or what CCL has to do with this, and I don't know whether<br>any of the above is directly useful. A program's behavior in this<br>regard has a lot to do with how it's invoked, and this may be<br>more true on OSX than on other platforms.<br><br><br><br><br>On Mon, 22 Dec 2008, Phil Armitage wrote:<br><br><blockquote type="cite">Hi,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">I distribute my GUI (LTK) application on three platforms (Mac OS X,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Windows and Linux) as either:<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">1) a directory containing a Lisp compiler + my code + required systems<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">+ a shell script to start it all up<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">2) a platform specific binary.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Either way, when I start the application by double-clicking I get the<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">GUI window *and* a 'terminal' window with the output from the Lisp<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">system. On Windows (currently using CLISP or SBCL) I can hide this<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">second window (actually it's really the first window) by having the<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">user run a small C program which starts the actual binary before<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">hiding itself from view. On Linux, this doesn't happen at all.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Is there anything I can do with CCL on OS X? I've looked at the<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">available compiler options but can see nothing related to this and<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">I've tried fiddling around with .command files, .term files and even<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Apple Script but all to no avail. As things stand, I get complaints<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">from users about this so any help would be much appreciated!<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Thanks,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">-- <br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Phil Armitage<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><a href="http://phil.nullable.eu/">http://phil.nullable.eu/</a><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">_______________________________________________<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Openmcl-devel mailing list<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><a href="mailto:Openmcl-devel@clozure.com">Openmcl-devel@clozure.com</a><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><a href="http://clozure.com/mailman/listinfo/openmcl-devel">http://clozure.com/mailman/listinfo/openmcl-devel</a><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote>_______________________________________________<br>Openmcl-devel mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Openmcl-devel@clozure.com">Openmcl-devel@clozure.com</a><br>http://clozure.com/mailman/listinfo/openmcl-devel<br><br></div></blockquote></div><br><div apple-content-edited="true"> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; -apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; -apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; -apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px"><font face="Helvetica" size="3" style="font: 12.0px Helvetica">Prof. Alexander Repenning</font></p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px"><br class="khtml-block-placeholder"></p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px">University of Colorado</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px">Computer Science Department</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px">Boulder, CO 80309-430</p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px"><br class="khtml-block-placeholder"></p><p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px"><font face="Helvetica" size="3" style="font: 12.0px Helvetica">vCard: <a href="http://www.cs.colorado.edu/~ralex/AlexanderRepenning.vcf">http://www.cs.colorado.edu/~ralex/AlexanderRepenning.vcf</a></font></p><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span></span></span></div></span> </div><br></body></html>