<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Great suggestions as usual, Rainer. <div><br></div><div>You're definitely right about cl-documentation and hemlock-commands having nothing to do with "context". I put them there mostly to show how multiple tools could be managed. As the IDE evolves, they should be put somewhere else.</div><div><br></div><div>You know as much about UI design in general and IDE design in particular as any Lisper I know. It's obviously something that interests you and something to which you have given a lot of thought.</div><div><br></div><div>Experienced programmers often look down their noses at IDEs. -- "Real programmers don't use IDEs". And if an IDE doesn't hit the target, they are right. The trick will be to develop a Lisp specific IDE that really hits the target. Then we will have a wonderful tool.</div><div><br></div><div>I would like to see you and Terje take the lead in this. Even if you don't have time to write code, your experience and overview would be invaluable.</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks for your comments --</div><div><div><br></div><div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>On Sep 11, 2009, at 4:47 AM, Rainer Joswig wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><br><div><div>Am 09.09.2009 um 03:18 schrieb Glen Foy:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">...</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><b>To give it a try:</b></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">cd ccl/contrib/</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">svn update</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; ">That will pull in new versions of all contribs, including Context-Menu-CM, List-Definitions-CM and Window-Parking-CM.</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; ">In the Listener or in ~/ccl-init.lisp execute these forms:</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 10px/normal Monaco; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">;;; Use your own path here, if you are using a local copy of the HyperSpec:</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 10px/normal Monaco; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">(setq gui::*hyperspec-root-url* (gui::pathname-to-url "/Lisp/hyperspec-7-0/"))</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 10px/normal Monaco; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">(require :context-menu-cm)</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 10px/normal Monaco; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">(require :cl-documentation-cm)</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 10px/normal Monaco; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">(require :list-definitions-cm)</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 10px/normal Monaco; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">(require :hemlock-commands-cm)</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 10px/normal Monaco; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">(require :window-parking-cm)</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 10px/normal Monaco; color: rgb(0, 79, 175); ">(cmenu:set-default-tool "List-Definitions-CM")</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>That's easy enough. Loads fine.<br><div><br></div><div>Boy, it is hard to keep up with Glen's contributions. Glen, thanks for your stuff. You deserve some feedback. CCL users should check it out. There is a lot of potential. With some more help we are getting in 'MCL mode' with many good IDE enhancements by contributors.</div><div><br></div><div>Some general feedback (feel free to ignore them ;-) ) :</div><div><br></div><div>* don't put too much in the context menu. But look for the context menu in Apple Mail for an example, or Xcode:</div><div><br></div><div><span><Bildschirmfoto 2009-09-11 um 10.23.14.png></span></div><div><br></div><div>* the 'context' menu often implies that the command is invoked on the context (the current point, the current selection, the current paragraph, the current symbol, the current buffer, ...).</div><div><br></div><div>* the cl-documentation and hemlock-commands contributions are really really great and very useful, but I would like to see them in the menu bar under the HELP menu or the TOOLS menu. Possibly with a palette style window, that floats on top. The palette window even could watch the current active buffer/listener and update the CL documentation info while you type or move over symbols. The hierarchical information is great.</div><div><br></div><div>DashCode uses them for example for a snippet library.</div><div><br></div><div><span><Bildschirmfoto 2009-09-11 um 10.38.46.png></span></div><div><br></div><div>It would be great to have your CL documentation hierarchy and some code snippets that could be contributed and copied from there. Like WITH-OPEN-FILE, snippets for opening a file for reading/writing, appending to a file, etc.</div><div><br></div><div>* the existing commands (like cut, copy paste, and the stuff from the services menu) should still be there. (I wonder why in stock CCL 64 under Mac OS X 10.6.1 I only get one useful service command 'Make New Mail Note'.)</div><div><br></div><div>* I would put a configuration command for the context menu in some menu in the menubar, not in the menu itself.</div><div><br></div><div>* it would be very useful if several command collections could be active</div><div><br></div><div>Warmest regards,</div><div><br></div><div>Rainer Joswig</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px; "><div><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>Rainer Joswig, Hamburg, Germany</div><div><a href="http://lispm.dyndns.org/">http://lispm.dyndns.org/</a></div><div><a href="mailto:joswig@lisp.de">mailto:joswig@lisp.de</a></div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"> </div> <br></div>_______________________________________________<br>Openmcl-devel mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Openmcl-devel@clozure.com">Openmcl-devel@clozure.com</a><br>http://clozure.com/mailman/listinfo/openmcl-devel<br></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></body></html>