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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/30/2015 08:29 AM, Stelian Ionescu
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:1448897373.55098.453579929.387EDE92@webmail.messagingengine.com"
type="cite">
<title></title>
<div>If you want to keep the master copy in SNV and mirror to git,
SubGit can do that but mapping externals to submodules is not
supported: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.subgit.com/remote-book.html">http://www.subgit.com/remote-book.html</a> chapter
9.<br>
</div>
<div>If you want to keep the master copy in git and access it
through SVN, Github supports that: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://help.github.com/articles/support-for-subversion-clients/">https://help.github.com/articles/support-for-subversion-clients/</a>.
Again, mapping submodules to externals is not supported.<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div>That said, as far as I understand it, there are two reasons
why binaries are bundles with the sources:<br>
</div>
<div>1) for easy distribution of released binaries together with
the code so that those who only use releases can also M-. (or
equivalent) without hassles.<br>
</div>
<div>2) for easy bootstrap because of compiler and/or ABI(such as
fasl format) changes within a release.</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Several years ago this was essentially how CCL was distributed - one
checked out sources from CVS and a<br>
a matching tarball via FTP or equivalent, and that was it. At the
time, there were two possible choice of<br>
tarballs., one for 32-bit PPC Linux and another for 32-bit PPC
Darwin.<br>
<br>
Some of the smartest people that I've ever known were very confused
by this, and I think that having<br>
a single way for users to obtain a consistent set of sources and
binaries is very important. SVN offers<br>
this via "external properties", which are otherwise a mess. If Git
does as well, I have not seen anyone<br>
describe the mechanism.<br>
<br>
I don't otherwise care whether one uses "svn co something" or "git
clone something", but I would<br>
not want to expect users to have to revert back to what didn't work
well long ago.<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:1448897373.55098.453579929.387EDE92@webmail.messagingengine.com"
type="cite">
<div> </div>
<div>These two issues can be solved by bundling all release
binaries into a single tarball, and ensuring that during the
development phase the compiler can always be easily bootstrapped
from the previous released binaries. This second part, though,
I'm unsure how difficult it is.<br>
</div>
<div>All of it makes sense thinking about only if there's the
feeling that git is worth it. In my little world, I have so much
tooling around git, including the wonderful Magit client for
Emacs, that unless I'm really determined I don't contribute to
non-Git projects any more, except for maybe opening bugs.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>><br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>note that there are technical solutions that allow
bi-directional mirroring<br>
</div>
<div> between svn and git, and if I understand correctly at
least one of them is<br>
</div>
<div> free (as in beer) for open-source projects. see <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.subgit.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.subgit.com">www.subgit.com</a></a>.<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div> I am personally very skeptical that switching from svn to
git would solve more problems<br>
</div>
<div> than it would introduce, but I may be mistaken about
that. Clozure's policy has generally<br>
</div>
<div> been to give svn commit access to anyone who asks for it,
but I don't think that too many<br>
</div>
<div> people have asked. I don't think that the current system
is ideal by any means, and I don't<br>
</div>
<div> object to anything that would make CCL easier for more
people to use and contribute to. Why would I?<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> It's a slightly different issue, but the fact that Linux
itself uses git does not mean that<br>
</div>
<div> everyone has to deal with constant chaos (aside from the
usual chaos of Linux itself ...)<br>
</div>
<div> I don't know that we would be any more or less responsive
to git pull requests than<br>
</div>
<div> we are to Trac tickets.<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div> I agree that "switching to git" would likely only be
successful for anyone<br>
</div>
<div> if Clozure was actively involved in some way. my own
scepticism is (I think)<br>
</div>
<div> based on technical concerns. I don't -think- that anyone
at Clozure objects<br>
</div>
<div> to the idea because we want to retain svn out of love for
svn or out of<br>
</div>
<div> a desire to hoard code which is freely available. If
someone wants to import<br>
</div>
<div> the svn repository into git, nothing is stopping them and
if they do so in a<br>
</div>
<div> way that deals with binaries and sources in a reasonable
way that would<br>
</div>
<div> help to allay a lot of my scepticism. That's not the last
step, but it would<br>
</div>
<div> likely be a good first step.<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div>On 11/29/2015 10:48 PM, Ron Garret wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:E7C6C6FD-B26B-4DF5-B2DC-C70E7262C041@flownet.com">
<div> </div>
<div>
<div>On Nov 29, 2015, at 8:39 PM, Gary Byers <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:gb@clozure.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:gb@clozure.com">gb@clozure.com</a></a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div>If anyone wants to import the CCL svn repository
into git and host it on github,<br>
</div>
<div> what exactly is stopping them ?<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div> </div>
<div> If there is some answer to that question - other
than the fact that no one has<br>
</div>
<div> time or sees a clear benefit to doing so that
would justify the disruption that<br>
</div>
<div> it would likely cause - I haven't heard it, and if
there is some technical reason<br>
</div>
<div> I can't think of it.<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> see <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://help.github.com/articles/importing-from-subversion/">https://help.github.com/articles/importing-from-subversion/</a>,
and the url<br>
</div>
<div> that that the tool referenced on that page wants
is likely <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://svn.clozure.com/publicsvn/openmcl/"><http://svn.clozure.com/publicsvn/openmcl/></a><br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div> Thanks for volunteering. Good luck, and please
let us know how you dealt with the issues that some
people were trying to<br>
</div>
<div> discuss.<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div> </div>
<div>The problem is not importing the current SVN repo into
Git. The problem is the on-going work of keeping the git
repo up to date if the “official” repo (i.e. the one that
you’re checking changes into) is still in SVN, and also
the problem of pulling changes in the git repo (if there
are any, and there might be because github pull requests
are pretty handy) back into the “official” SVN repo.
Otherwise CCL will fork, and that’s probably not a good
thing.<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div>For this reason it would be very helpful to have
Clozure Associates’ official blessing for switching to
git, assuming such a thing were in fact desirable. I’m a
git fan, but since CA is still doing the lion’s share of
the work I think this ought to be entirely CA's call.<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div>rg<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div> </div>
<div><u>_______________________________________________</u><br>
</div>
<div>Openmcl-devel mailing list<br>
</div>
<div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Openmcl-devel@clozure.com">Openmcl-devel@clozure.com</a><br>
</div>
<div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://lists.clozure.com/mailman/listinfo/openmcl-devel">https://lists.clozure.com/mailman/listinfo/openmcl-devel</a><br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div> </div>
<div id="sig4916231">
<div class="signature"> </div>
<div class="signature">--<br>
</div>
<div class="signature">Stelian Ionescu a.k.a. fe[nl]ix<br>
</div>
<div class="signature">Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum
videtur.<br>
</div>
<div class="signature"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://common-lisp.net/project/iolib">http://common-lisp.net/project/iolib</a><br>
</div>
</div>
<div> </div>
</blockquote>
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