<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Yep, Newtonscript also used a prototype-based object system, broadly similar to Object Lisp and Self. Javascript sort of resembles Newtonscript, enough so that I wonder if Brendan Eich was familiar with it.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">And Ralf Stoye reminded us that MCL had stack groups. I'd forgotten!<br class=""><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Mar 5, 2022, at 11:11 AM, Jeremy Jones <<a href="mailto:jaj@clozure.com" class="">jaj@clozure.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="auto" class="">The CLOS window system got a lot from the Object Lisp window. In Object Lisp you do something like (I'm sure that I'm mis-rembering details):<div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">(setq w (oneof window))</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">And a window would appear. You could move it, resize it, etc. Then you could do:</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">(ask w (add (oneof button)))</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">And a clickable button would appear in the window. </div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">I was disappointed when the Common Lisp committee chose Flavors as the basis of CLOS. It was understandable given the clout of Symbolics.</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">Javascript, the most popular programming language in the world, has a lot of similarities to Object Lisp. Both are prototype based instead of class based. You can make a new object that inherits from another. You can share the parent's variables and functions, or you can give it it's own:</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">(ask w</div><div dir="auto" class=""> (have 'title)</div><div dir="auto" class=""> (setq title "My Window"))</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Mar 5, 2022, 11:17 AM mikel evins <<a href="mailto:mevins@me.com" class="">mevins@me.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word;line-break:after-white-space" class="">My memory is that the UI framework in Object Lisp and, later, CLOS, was much easier and more convenient to work with than other ways of building classic Mac user interfaces. One reason is that you could build up a UI interactively in real time by evaluating Lisp expressions at the Listener. After the transition to CLOS, you could make a working window that responded appropriately to mouse events by saying<div class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""> (make-instance 'window)<br class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I don't remember the exact Object Lisp syntax, but it was similarly simple.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The Mac got threads in System 7, in the form of the Thread Manager. If I remember right, MCL/CCL didn't get thread support until the OpenMCL fork, though you could have used MCL's toolbox interface to talk to the Thread Manager before that.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Before OSX the Mac system was a cooperative multitasking system using what is nowadays called green threads.</div><div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Mar 5, 2022, at 1:18 AM, Tim McNerney <<a href="mailto:mc@media.mit.edu" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" class="">mc@media.mit.edu</a>> wrote:</div><br class=""><div class=""><div dir="auto" class="">Thanks for pointers to the “digital orphans” web museums. <div class="">Which brings me back to my other question…</div><div class="">Some of us remember that building a “well behaved GUI” for the Mac was a pain to code.</div><div class="">Did ObjectLisp and successors make this any easier with their OOness?</div><div class="">Could I implement widgets that responded to mouse clicks “on their own,”</div><div class="">or was there always editing of the dreaded “main event loop” for each new widget?</div><div class="">Some examples, if handy, would be good fodder for conversation.</div><div class="">Lastly, when did MacOS get full-fledged threads?</div><div class="">Or, since I’m taking to MCL devs, when did CCL start supporting threads?<br class=""><br class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">--Tim</div><div dir="ltr" class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">On Mar 4, 2022, at 13:23, Jeremy Jones <<a href="mailto:jaj@clozure.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" class="">jaj@clozure.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""><br class=""></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div dir="auto" class="">Thanks Gene! They appear to have disk images of lots of old stuff.<div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">They even have MCL 1.3 (pre-CLOS)!</div><div dir="auto" class=""><a href="https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/macintosh-allegro-common-lisp" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" class="">https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/macintosh-allegro-common-lisp</a> <br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div><div dir="auto" class="">I've been wanting to play with Object Lisp. A weekend project! </div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class=""></div></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Mar 4, 2022, 11:37 AM Gene Z. Ragan <<a href="mailto:gene@semitone.audio" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" class="">gene@semitone.audio</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word;line-break:after-white-space" class="">The Macintosh Garden is a nice resource for classic software releases.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><a href="https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/macintosh-common-lisp-20" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/macintosh-common-lisp-20</a></div><div class=""><a href="https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/pearl-lisp" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/pearl-lisp</a></div><div class=""><a href="https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/macintosh-allegro-common-lisp" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/macintosh-allegro-common-lisp</a></div><div class=""><a href="https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/xlisp" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/xlisp</a></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">You may be able to find what you are looking for there.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Gene<br class=""><div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Mar 3, 2022, at 10:26 PM, Tim McNerney <<a href="mailto:mc@media.mit.edu" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">mc@media.mit.edu</a>> wrote:</div><br class=""><div class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><span class="">Motivated by my recent purchase of a refurbished Mac Classic (*),</span><div class="">I am searching for a couple of types of “prehistoric” software. <div class=""><div class="">1) 68000 MCL that runs in 4MB of RAM and a tiny B/W screen. (**)</div><div class="">2) examples of early Mac apps written in MCL with decent UIs.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">(*) With a BlueSCSI SSD instead of a fragile HDD.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Is the rumor true that Coral Software delivered a complete Common Lisp </div><div class="">compressed onto a single 9cm floppy? (3 1/2”)</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><span class="">(**) I’m not looking for one of these physical floppies. </span></div><div class=""><font class=""><span class="">9cm floppies were notorious, even brand new, of not being archival. </span></font></div><div class=""><font class=""><span class="">Some sort of disk image would be better. <br class=""></span></font><br class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">--Tim</div></div></div></div></div>_______________________________________________<br class="">Openmcl-devel mailing list<br class=""><a href="mailto:Openmcl-devel@clozure.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">Openmcl-devel@clozure.com</a><br class=""><a href="https://lists.clozure.com/mailman/listinfo/openmcl-devel" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://lists.clozure.com/mailman/listinfo/openmcl-devel</a><br class=""></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></div></div>_______________________________________________<br class="">
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