[Openmcl-devel] Errors Creating NSTimer

Andrew Shalit alms at clozure.com
Sun Oct 28 13:41:12 PDT 2007

I wanted to respond to these messages from Phil and Brent.

It's sometimes hard to strike the right balance between "leading  
people on" and "leaving people out" when working on an open source  
project, and we're still learning that.  The various pieces of  
technology that Clozure has released or talked about recently --- a  
Mac IDE, an Intel-32 port, EasyGUI, etc --- are all fairly new  
developments.  At first we didn't talk about them because we didn't  
know whether or not they would ever be real. Then we didn't talk about  
them because we were all too slammed with other obligations (e.g. paid  
work) to package things up and put a message together.  Finally, the  
situation with MCL forced us to prioritize getting something out there  
even if it wasn't pretty.

At this point I think it's safe to say that the IDE is real.  The  
other two probably are, as well, but that would be contingent on  
feedback from you folks that these are useful directions, and we  
certainly don't have schedules.

So, Brent, please don't throw out your high level GUI stuff just yet.

And Phil --- We literally just realized (d'oh) that people could use  
the 32-bit Intel port to access Carbon libraries.  We had mostly been  
thinking about it in terms of getting to the installed base of Linux  
and potentially Windows machines out there. (Yes, a Windows port is  
another possible direction.  No, we haven't started one.  Yes, we are  
interested.  If you'd like to work on it or fund it, let us know.  
Please don't build your product plans on it unless you hear more from  
us!)  We hadn't thought about its impact on the Mac -- "Apple shipped  
32-bit only Macs for such a short time, it doesn't really matter," was  
mostly we thought about 32-bit Intel and the Mac.  But you're right,  
you could use it to access Carbon once it's finished.  And just to say  
it once more, we don't know when that will be. So I hope we haven't  
wasted too much of your time.

In terms of a survey for OpenMCL users: yes, we want to put that  
together.  Meanwhile, if you have any feedback, or if you have ideas  
for what directions we should go or what questions we should ask on  
such a survey, let us know either on-list or via private e-mail if  
you'd rather.


On Oct 25, 2007, at 1:20 AM, Brent Fulgham wrote:

> I know Clozure is a company with its own goals and plans, and that  
> OpenMCL isn't exactly a community project, but I was hoping that we  
> would have seen more of the "Clozure CL" work being discussed on  
> this list.  For example, I was kind of surprised to suddenly see the  
> EasyGUI stuff appear in CVS without any hints that this was going  
> on.  I had written a bunch of (probably crappy) code to do similar  
> stuff for the Open Agent Engine port, which I guess I'll throw out  
> now.  Probably no great loss to the Universe at large, but it feels  
> like wasted time!
> I don't mean to sound to whiney -- I think OpenMCL is the best Lisp  
> out there (and looks like it will be getting even better!), but it  
> would be nice to have a better feel for what's being worked on, what  
> kinds of tasks might be helpful to the overall project, etc.
> Thanks,
> -Brent

And on Oct 24, 2007, at 9:53 PM, Phil wrote:

> Andrew,
> Fair enough and thanks for the reply.  You might want to think about  
> running a similar survey here to what was posted on gmane (obviously  
> tailored for Clozure CL users) and communicating things that are  
> being worked on or would be if funding could be obtained (i.e.  
> solicit contributions to see if, in aggregate, it can be funded.)   
> Maybe it is and I'm just not looking in the right place... in that  
> case: where should I be checking?  You might be surprised to find  
> some people willing to donate funds and/or time if it would help get  
> some things done but may not individually be able to provide  
> everything that is needed.  I was banging my head on my desk after  
> reading that there apparently is a 32-bit Intel version coming... I  
> spent ~6 months rewriting code in Obj-C because largely because it  
> was previously stated that this wasn't going to happen.  Don't get  
> me wrong: this is great news, but I would have happily donated some  
> funds to help make this happen and spent those 6 months getting  
> other things done on my end... but that didn't appear to be an  
> option at the time so I went with plan B.
> Thanks,
> Phil

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